Friday, November 17, 2006

Family Pictures



We have ALL been battling the flu this week and it has NOT been fun! Its So sad to see your kids in pain and unable to help. Its especially hard to watch your 11 month throwing up. This is the first time that Jack has been this sick either but he handled it pretty good considering. Its a good thing because its hard to do much when both mom and dad are sick as well.
So, now that we are all "flu free" we decided to get our fall family pictures taken. They took some time because we had a hard time getting Asher to smile at the right times and look into the camera but in the end they turned out pretty good I think.
Hey did you guys see that news report about tha lady who got kicked off of a plane for nursing her baby? What the hell is that about?? Ughh, that really pisses me off!

146 comments:

Anonymous said...

It's true that she has the right to breastfeed her child in public, but I still think she should have just taken the blanket and used it when they asked her to. I understand if you couldn't use a blanket for a newborn... at first Alli couldn't feed Lucy with a blanket over her, because she had to see what was going on and if Lucy was latching on right... but a 22 month old is probably pretty good at going to town... so c'mon lady, if they want you to use the blanket, just use the blanket to avoid the problem altogether!

Sarafu said...

The problem with that argument is that every child is different and not all will nurse with blankets. Jack did fine with a blanket (but let me say it took alot longer than 4 weeks to be able to latch him on with a blanket over me, So go ALi!) but Asher is a completley different story. He will NOT nurse with a blanket over him. He gets frustrated and either acts like he is suffacating or just pulls it off. I have tried numerous times but he wants to see whats going on while he is nursing. I beleive that I am a pretty modest nurser and dont think the blanket matters anyway. In your defense Sara, I have to say if heard this story before I had kids or maybe even after just having Jack who nursed fine with a blanket, I probablly would have felt the same. But with different life experiences I gain understanding. If it were me I probablly would have taken the blanket but assured the flight attendant that he would not keep it over him for more than 5 seconds.

jenny said...

i agreed with the blanket covering thing because sometimes people just are sensitive about things maybe they're not used to being around ie breastfeeding, and I wanted to be sensitive to THAT. however! i had a mommy point out the fact that not all babies will eat this way, and some can't because of allergy or asthma problems. her clincher (which i now ABSOLUTELY agree with) was "i wouldn't want to have to eat my lunch with a hot blanket blocking my face, why should my child have to?" preach on sister, preach on.

Elizabeth F. said...

ughhh...as a new, first-time mama I tried to use a blanket which usually did not work. The baby is hot and sweaty and one of the reasons for BFing is so that you can hold your baby close and have eye-to-eye contact. That's one of the reasons you bond more with BFing. Now, as an experienced nurser I never use blankets and I would not use them just because someone else is uncomfortable. I think more people need to have BFing "in their face" so to speak to make it a norm in our society. It amazes me of how prudish our society is when it comes to feeding a baby, but not in movies, the way girls dress, etc... It is such a double standard and it totally pisses me off! I hope that lady sues Delta for all that they are worth! Why does everyone keep picking on mamas who are just trying to do the best thing for their babies...which is Breastfeeding!!!!

John F. said...

I wish this would happen to Elizabeth because I would own Delta. Lets see them take all food or drinks off airplanes and see how meny poeple bitch about it. or maybe nursing women sould only be able to fly Hooters airlines then the poeple on that flight would want to see boobs. I hope that lady never has to work or at least pay for another flight for the rest of her life.

Daniel said...

I think the Hooters airlines is a good idea. Let's just put all nursing mothers on that airline. Then the guys on that airline could really get their fill.

leviathen said...

can i just fly the hooters airline.....

:)

l.

Elizabeth F. said...

that Hooter's airline is so gross and cheesy! (From what I've seen on TV) I wouldn't be caught dead on it, and I definitely would not take the baby on it either!

Daniel said...

I'd only fly it for the wings. Honest.

Daniel said...

Get it...Hooters...wings. Airplane....wings. He he he. I crack myself up.

Anonymous said...

It's not really that I haven't had kids and I don't understand, because I understand just fine. But if it really was such a big deal (which it shouldn't have been) that they were going to throw her off the plane, she could have done something. She was on the inside row in the back, so maybe she could have draped the blanket in a way that the baby's face wasn't covered up, but so there was some sort of curtain between the baby and the people walking down the aisles.

I agree that it should be commonplace to have mothers nursing in public. But right now, it's offensive to some people. Should it be? Absolutely not! But we can't just go around saying, "Damn it, it should be this way, so I'm gonna make it this way!"

Sarafu said...

caberet99The problem is that it is ALWAYS going to be uncomfortable to SOMEONE, Especially if we dont continue to do it and make it more common in society. The lady was probablly trying to make a statment and good for her. Sara, I wasnt trying to say you dont know what you are talking about because you dont have kids (please dont be offended) but the fact is that ALMOST EVERYTHING I said before I had kids about what I would do when I had kids, I have done the opposite. NOT because I was stupid, but because I just didnt have kids yet and didnt really know how I would feel about certain things. My whole perspective on EVERYTHING changed and continually changes daily as my kids move into different phases. Of Course, some of it may have been God trying to knock me on my A@# too because I tended to be a bit condesending and know it allish. :) For the record, Sara, I dont think that you are speaking out of that. :)
John and E, I loved your point!
For Gods sake people!! If people didnt have such a sexual issue with breasts they woudnt be offended. If they looked at them as a source of food and comfort (which is their Primary purpose) they wouldnt have any reason to be offended. Its hard enough to breastfeed our children in this freakin country(especially extended nursing) without all this crap. Whatever happened to doing the best for our children and making them the priority. OH wait, its all about US these days! Sorry, I'm ranting! Its my soapbox! I could go on and on but I will spare you! Hey Elizabeth, we can rant about this tomorrow when i see you! YAY!!!!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

No worries, girl, I'm not offended at all! Sorry if it came off that way, it's kind of hard to convey tone when you're typing.

If I was offended, I'd just toilet paper your house to make myself feel better! LOL.

Anonymous said...

Food and comfort! Yay boobies! Personally, I think boobies are great! But they'd be greater if they dispensed cold beer.

Anonymous said...

I'm sure my husband would agree with me. ;)

Elizabeth F. said...

oh that it hilarious about the beer!

If anyone wants to see a really cute picture of my baby nursing while holding his kitty in a head lock go to my blog! It is modest, I promise! He wanted to nurse, but he did not want kitty to get away.

Mrs. Sara...You are right, BFing is not totally accepted (in our society). Some areas are better than others though. But, I agree with Sara that the only way to change that is for us mamas to be out there in public, nursing, and taking the brunt for BFing to ever be the norm. I so passionately believe in it that I am willing to take a stand on this issue. I really don't care if I offend anyone. Sometimes we grow when we are stretched beyond our comfort zones. Believe me, I have my areas too. I BFeed very modestly. And I try to be even more considerate around men. But it just amazes me that in our society just about every health organization (W.H.O-World Health Organization, A.A.P-American Academy of Pediatrics, etc...) all tell us that Breast milk is best---even formula companies say Breast milk is best--with all of that "backing" Breastfeeding is still not the norm and moms are shunned and criticized for doing what health professionals say is the BEST! The only thing that will change our society is NURSING IN PUBLIC!! I refuse to be a closet nurser or covering up because no one wants to see me nurse. It's a free country...look the other way!

Ok...I feel better! Sorry for my rant. I just can't help myself on this topic.

Amy said...

I understand your points, but on the other hand you have to realize we live in a post Sept. 11th era! If you are on a plane and you are asked or told to do or not to do something...you listen! I understand some people are sensitive about breast feeding and probably shouldn't have complained, but the point is, a flight attendant has to make ALL passengers feel safe and fairly comfortable. I don't care what a flight attendant requests, you do it without complaint or you will get kicked off the airline. If we start making exception to this rule, people will question the authority of the attendant.

Anonymous said...

Careful, she could have a concealed weapon hidden in her bra! Oh no, she has two!

Amy, you bring up an interesting point. I see what you're saying about obeying the flight attendants.

Sarafu said...

Amy, I kinda see what your saying but I have to say that I dont really agree just for the simple fact that I cant see any safety issues brought up with nursing. Plus, there is legislation in place in Vermont that a woman has the right to breastfeed wherever she pleases so how does the flight attendant get around that?

Elizabeth F. said...

I'm sorry, but I am not going to NOT feed my hungry, crying baby because a flight attendant tells me not to.

Also, the flight attendant was obviously in the wrong, because Delta asked her to reboard the flight. They knew that they had made a bad call and a big deal would be made out of it! State laws mandate that a Bfing mother has the right to Bfeed any public place that she has a right to be. The exceptions would be in a church or a private residence.

Tammy said...

Okay, I have to ask something. First of all let me say, that I am not against breastfeeding at all. Nor am I against bottle feeding. I don't think that breast feeding necessarily makes you bond closer to your child though. I couldn't be closer to any of my children and I breastfed none of them. Believe it or not, I think it was taboo back when I had kids. You just didn't see it or really even hear of it. Weird, huh! But I am not bothered by it at all. My question is: Why are churches excluded from the places that are okay to breast feed in or at? And why do they have nursing mother rooms, why do they separate them from the congregation? I just think it is weird that the very place you go to worship the creator who created the way of nourishing the infant is exempt from public feeding. If it is okay to breastfeed in a restaurant, store, park, plane,...and so on without being separated from the general public, then why not in a church? I don't get that one, and was wondering if anyone knew why.

Daniel said...

Tammy,
To answer your question of "why", here is my answer, as best I see it. (from a dads point of view)
Pertaining to the Valpo Vineyard, (because that is where we go) it is more of a "retreat" than it is "separation" It is a place of privacy, yes, but it is also a place of seclusion for the congregation's sake, as well as the nursing mothers. By that, I mean, it is a place not only where mothers can feed their nursing children, but also a place where they can go so as to not distract the majority, (everyone there who is NOT a nursing mother) from the cries of their babies. Thus, the reason why our room as a one way mirror, so that they can see (as well as hear) what is going on.
So churches are not a place that is excluded as a place of nursing their children, but rather a place that offers an alternative so as not to distract the majority. If a mother chooses to nurse while "in the midst", then that is her prerogative, and, for the most part, accepted. I've never heard of a church that shunned a nursing mother for providing her child from eating. If you have, I'd love to know of it, because I'm sure there are a dozen or two women who read this blog who will have letters going out within the week. (I'd say, within the day, but with the holiday and all.....)

John F. said...

Daniel I agree you said it perfectly, Amy I might get your point but like you said they want every one to be comfy accept the baby oh and then when that baby is crying because he/she his hungry everyone else on that plane is going to bitch and moune until the FA says something to the mother about the baby crying. From a security side for the discution how does feeding your baby link you to blowing up a F*#&ing plane there is NO SECURITY THREAT in that sitution so there for the request by the FA is not for the safety of the plane and its passengers.

Anonymous said...

Okay, what happened to Elizabeth's blog?

Elizabeth F. said...

Sara needs to fix the link to my blog...

leviathen said...

I have never actually heard of a church not letting mothers nurse their babies, but as far as the law goes...they have the right. I do not agree with it however, but it's probably because of people being scared of seeing some "flesh" at church. he...he...

leviathen said...

by the way.. that was actually Elizabeth..... who happened to hijack my computer.

l.

Anonymous said...

NO BOOBIES IN THE HOUSE OF GOD!

Elizabeth F. said...

Right now, Delta Airlines is contemplating officially supporting the Breastfeeding Promotion Act which is currently before Congress. So please give Delta a call to thank them for taking a strong stand on behalf of breastfeeding mothers, and encourage Delta to actively support the Breastfeeding Promotion Act. Getting more signatures on the petition helps let our leaders know that citizen support is strong.

*To sign the petition (and ask friends to sign on), go to: http://www.momsrising.org/breastfeeding-petition

Tammy said...

Daniel, no I don't know of any churches that have shunned a nursing mother. I was just asking the because of what Elizabeth posted about the state law:

State laws mandate that a Bfing mother has the right to Bfeed any public place that she has a right to be. The exceptions would be in a church or a private residence.


And because I thought about the nursing mothers rooms. But I think initially I just misunderstood the statement that Elizabeth posted....cause it made more sense when I read it again.
sorry for the confusion!!

patty said...

I don't read as much as I should, I just read this so wanted to give my take. I was one of those that thought I will NEVER breastfeed my baby in public. I won't even do it at the relative's house. I will go to the back bedroom. And most times I did. But you get to a point (and I still do and Annalynn is 2 1/2) where you are just tired of "fighting it" and tired from your day and the hassle of holding a kid and getting through the lines and you just wanna feed the baby and get on with life. I tried using a blanket for Annalynn and she'd always grab it and throw it off. Was I overtaken by a newborn? Yes. I was not coordinated. I only had 2 hands and I was holding her with one and trying to reach across my fat ass body and keep the blanket on and sometimes I just gave up. She would NOT keep it on. SO..........feed yer kid and if it's offensive to the other person, they should just look away.

jenny said...

amen sister patty

Elizabeth F. said...

It does suck to have to go and separate yourself from the party/get-together or whatever and go hide in the bedroom to feed your baby. It gets old after a while. Maybe it's selfish on my part, but then again most of my friends have no problem with me nursing in front of them. And MOST mothers are discreet. You see whackos on TV, but that is not the norm.

To answer Tammy's question: I have no idea why the law states it that way. Maybe it gives churches (maybe they are considered private) the right to choose if it is appropriate. Probably b/c people are scared of seeing boobs in the house of God! It cracks me up, but I have always been thankful for nursing moms rooms!! And I have never had a problem nursing at church.

Also, yes Tammy it was very Taboo to nurse your baby until recent years. Many women were told by their doctors that their milk was too weak and their babies would not be nurished from it. There was a time when Science was valued more than Nature. It is so sad for many mothers who wanted to nurse their babies, but were told that they couldn't. Most people do not have the advantage of having experienced nursing one child and not nursing another to understand the difference. I have. I can tell you honestly that nursing does help you to bond with your baby. When you do not nurse it takes more effort to be close, maybe you did those things cause you are a smart mama!

patty said...

uh, I just wanted to say one more thing. I re-read this and it sounds like I am still nursing Annalynn. I am not. I nursed her til she was almost 2. In the beginning I wrote "...still tired of fighting it..." I meant fighting a situation in general. Okay, not that it really matters, but I did want to make that clear for those that don't know us. haha.

Anonymous said...

Pat, I don't think many women reading this blog would have a problem if you DID still nurse her.

Elizabeth F. said...

Pat, when I read your comment I thought you were still nursing her, but I was confused cause I thought you had weaned a while back. Not that it matters either way, but thanks for clearing that up!

Daniel said...

Yeah, thanks for clearing that up. Breastfeeding past 1 year is just gross. Er, ah....I mean, acceptable.....I mean, healthy. Umn, I mean, good for the baby.
You know...

patty said...

Okay, I just think that about 20 nursing moms should all plan a weekend shopping trip and all get on the same airline and just LET 'ER RIP.......hee hee hee.......there I go.......I was always the rebel.........

Anonymous said...

I'm not a nursing mom, but hell, I'm always looking for a reason to whip my boobs out! I'll go!

Sarafu said...

LOL! Sign me up. If we are going to be on a plane we might as well make the destination worth while. How about Hawaii? :)

Elizabeth F. said...

I'll go! Hawaii sounds great!! Anyone "Tandem nursing?" That would really freak some people out!!

(Tandem is still Bfing an older sibling and nursing the baby. Sometimes at the same time, or seperately...but having a BFing relationship with 2 kids at the same time.) P.S. I have not been that brave yet. :-)Maybe with the next one!! (LOL!)

birdietwoshoes said...

41 comments! Who knew such a post would cause such discussion! However, I barely know Sara and I don't know Elizabeth at all, but I know you guys feel strongly about this subject. I am on the fence on this issue... For those who don't know me, I just had my first baby 1 month ago and I have been breastfeeding. I am VERY modest and would probably never b/f in public. I don't even feel comfortable doing it in front of close friends. I would feel uncomfortable if a total stranger next to me on a plane started breastfeeding. (I can see Sara and Liz rolling their eyes and sighing at me now! Sorry girls!) But it's not really an issue of thinking breastfeeding in public is wrong or should be against the law or anything. It's just me... I do think it's ridiculous that here in America we don't flinch when we see sex, violence, drug use, etc, but people have an issue with breastfeeding mothers. So do you see how I'm on the fence here? I think it's stupid that people have issues with it, yet, I have a little issue with it. :) Hopefully no one thinks badly of me. Just expressing my opinion. I'll be quiet now. (I do have to admit though, I'd breastfeed with all you ladies on a plane for sure if we were all on our way to Hawaii! ;) We could even make a movie out of it-- Instead of "Snakes on a Plane" it could be "Boobies on a Plane.")

birdietwoshoes said...

I can't believe I just posted "Boobies on a Plane" on the internet... :)

Anonymous said...

I'm sure it wasn't the first time, Birdie, and it won't be the last! There are probably lots of people talking about boobies on a plane! LOL.

I'm pretty sure that when I breastfeeding my future children, I won't be very modest in front of close friends. In public, yeah, but girlfriends aren't "public!" :)

Annette said...

I think the real problem is that Americans in general are desensatized. Seeing sex or whatever on tv is a given...everyone expects it now. You see and hear of it so often that no batts an eye anymore. The problem is no one sees the movie stars as someone's daughter, mother or son. They are images on a big screen. When you are faced with it personally and sitting next to you...you are forced to think about it and realize what is happening. A computer edited boob on a movie screen is less "threatening" than an exposed breast next to on a plane or across the booth at a restaurant. I'm not saying it's wrong to breast feed your child in public...hear my heart. I'm just saying Americans see it so much as fake...then to see it for real they don't know what to do. I would be appauled, if I saw people having sex in the park across from my office. If I saw it in a movie I wouldn't think twice. It's a double standard and I think all of America is to blame for it. Whip those boobs out, if you want to. I don't think anyone has room to complain. I'm sure you show less breast feeding your child than most girls show on an average friday night.

jenny said...

sara wins 2 prizes: one for the most posts (i'm 46!! i should win a prize too!) and the second for the moments comments about boobs:)

Daniel said...

In the voice of Home Simpson.... "booo-bies" (with the trademark drool)

Elizabeth F. said...

I totally get what you guys are saying about breasts in person vs. on TV. Back to one of our main discussions that by more people BFing in public it can BECOME MORE NORMAL! Look at other cultures...no one thinks twice, because someone is just feeding their baby. Another little fact...in only 9 or so countries in the entire world are breasts considered a sexual part of the body. We are just an over-sexed society. I love the fact that boobs are multi-functional...but what do you think their main purpose was for? They make milk for a reason.

I saw a pic one time of a lady talking to the president/leader of her country while standing and nursing her baby!!! Group of people around...No one even batted an eye lash!! Now, I couldn't even do that!

I believe in nursing modestly. I don't believe in trying to make a spectacle of myself to promote BFing. And I was self-conscious and very worried about exposing myself with baby #1. I think that's totally normal. I just have some experience under my belt, so naturally you get more relaxed. I don't care if you nurse modestly or not...I'm just happy that WE are BFing b/c it's BEST for BABY!!! Yeah...us!!

Anonymous said...

But in the countries where breasts aren't considered sexual parts of the body, the ankles are... or the necks are... or the elbows are...

I guess what I'm saying is that there's nothing wrong with American men considering the breasts sexually appealing. There's definitely something wrong with them leering at breastfeeding women, hoping to catch a glimpse... but just the fact that breasts are sexually appealing to Americans doesn't make them perverts.

Men need to realize that boobs are also for feeding babies, but they can be used for sex, too! I definitely don't have a problem with it! :)

Anonymous said...

P.S. My husband is an elbow man. Yeah, baby.

Sarafu said...

Holy Crap!!! People have to so much to say about boobs!!! LOL!
Birdie, dont feel like Elizabeth and I dont understand what you are saying. We do and we have been there. I, can only speak for myself and say that I am just in a different phase with baby #2 and 3 and a half years of nursing under my belt. I NEVER nursed my first in public without a blanket and as he got older I became more free with where I nursed. Its like Patty said about just haivng enough with it. Of course it made a difference that I nursed Jack for 2 and a half years. If I was too worried about it I would have been confined to my house for that whole time and those who know me know that THat would NOT work for me. :)
I also wanted to give you all an example of how modest you can nurse without a blanket. I was at my familys for Thanksgiving in NC and my 15 year old football player cousin comes up to me and starts stroking Ashers head and telling me how sweet the baby is. He then asks if he can hold him. I didnt want to embarass him but I was nursing him the whole time. I simply said, "sure, as soon as he is finished eating" The poor kids face turned beat red and he started to chuckle because the entire table was laughung at this point.(He is a super sweet kid) He was strokig Ashers head and talking to him and had No clue that I was nursing. SEE, it can be done and most of the time that is how discreet people are.

Anonymous said...

I can vouch for that. A while back Dan and I went to Sara's house for dinner, and Sara was sitting right next to Dan nursing Asher, and Dan never even noticed! :)

Elizabeth F. said...

The difference between nursing a newborn and a toddler...

Newborn-Try not to expose breast while BFing in public.

Toddler-Trying to put off nursing your toddler in public to avoid criticism. No one notices your breast at that point, they're too busy being critical about how old you child is while nursing. There's always something to complain about!!

Funny...you don't hear those same people complaining about the types of bottles other babies use or how long they are still using them! I think nursing moms catch the brunt b/c we are in the minority. Bottle feeders do not fully understand the complexity of the BFing relationship. Only if you have done it can you really ever "get it".

So, if we make it to 100 comments, does #100 get a prize or anything? We could probably talk about this forever!LOL!

Annette said...

I fully understand what you guys are saying about the value of breast feeding however long you see needed. I am not going to lie and say I agree with it, but everyone has the right to choose as they will. In all honesty though...I would be just as taken back by a bottle fed 2 1/2-3 year old as I would be with a b/f child. I have the same response to a 5-8 year old who still has a sippy cup. I'm sure this little comment will bring several opinions out of many of you, but I just wanted to be honest since everyone else was. I am in no way judging you Sara for b/fing Jack to 2 1/2. I know that you have an amzing relationship with your kids.

Daniel said...

As long as everyone is being so honest, I'd just like to say that the term "BFing" is starting to bother me.

jenny said...

wondered how long it'd take for some person with a penis to mention BFing...that prize goes to daniel:) pretty funny!

Desiree said...

Just for clarification the reason that the laws don't cover church property in regards to breastfeeding(notice no BF:P),is because it would be an infringement on the whole separation of church and state thing. The government would cause a big rukus nationally if it created a bridge between church and state....but that is another blog post.

sarafu said...

I completly can see how people think its bizarre and out of the norm to nurse your child past the first year because i am guilty of thinking the same thing when I had Jack. My problem was that 1) I wasnt aware that my child was still just as much a baby 3 months after his first birthday as he was 2 days before. He didnt grow up overnight and weening wasnt something he was in anyway ready for. Second, I was not educated as to the actual benefits of extended nursing and didnt realize that most of the world nurses past what we consider normal. Our culture has alot to do with most of our issues with it, Or speaking for myself that it what influenced me the most.
Anyway, I think we could talk about this forever! :) In fact I think I will give a prize to the 100th comment! Maybe I could make a trophy in the shape of a boob!
LOL!
Hey, Birdie, Kendrah is a writer maybe we can get her to write us a screenplay for that movie!!! :)

Elizabeth F. said...

Daniel-Why is it bothering you? Just shorter...

Annette, I personally have felt that when my kids were around 2 it was time for ME to be done. They weren't nursing much anyway. They were too busy being toddlers. Something about being 2 is big to me, so I was ready for them to be big. Probably b/c I was pregnant again and looking forward to nursing a new baby. You would be surprised by the comments that people made to me about him nursing until he was 2 and their kids (I found out later) had a bottle until 3! Hilarious! It is funny though that many people talk about the magical 1 year of nursing and when that baby of yours is 1 yr. and 1 day old...they are still a baby and still need to nurse. Then, before you know it, they are 15 mos. and then 18 mos. Then you look at them and think, but he's still a baby! Most mothers do not start out Bfing thinking that they will nurse for an extended period. Most people want the first 6 mos. or 1st year. I was one of those too! As far as aippy cups go, Zoe and Xander do use big cups, but ztill use sippies on occassion. They do not bother me at all!! (Cause I am the one who has to clean up after spills!) But, I have seen an 8 year old with one, and thought it was really wierd and baby-ish. I see what you are saying! Poor Sara, her blogs gone crazy! Aren't those kids of hers cute?

Daniel said...

There's that acronym "Bfing" again!!

Anonymous said...

Just so everyone knows, the World Health Organization recommends that mothers breastfeed their children to age 2, as do many other health organizations.

Anonymous said...

In light of that, I'm going to nurse my children until they're 2, and then see when they're ready to quit. I don't want to force them off the boob, but at the same time, if two or three months go by after their 2nd birthday and they're not showing signs of self-weaning, I'll probably start.

Anonymous said...

Also, Daniel, don't feel bad. The first time I saw Elizabeth talk about BFing, I was like, "Whoa lady, too much information!" LMAO. I've got a dirty mind sometimes.

Anonymous said...

By the way, Fu, I notice you have the wrong link for my blog. It's now http://saharagreen.blogspot.com

patty said...

Okay, let's just go for the 100 comment mark.....here's a new one...When Annalynn was almost 2, she was not nursing very much either. Mostly just for comfort, like if she fell off the rocker and bashed her head on the floor, she'd come to me and cry and want to nurse. So one thing I read in a book was when that happened, start giving TONS of kisses and OODLES of hugs.......and I started doing that when she got hurt and she pretty much quit on her own. PLUS the fact that she had QUITE a few teeth at 2 and lemme tell ya, YEAH, you get bit once and it's NOT fun.........I screamed loud enough it scared her too and I thought Okay, this is it. Time to find another way to comfort. And like I said, she quit almost entirely herself. And here's another WACKY thing, when I was married to my first husband (yes, for those of you who don't know, that's one of my skeletons......) he had an aunt who was not quite "with it" upstairs if ya know what I mean. His little nephew was almost 5 and ready to go into kindergarten and he was STILL ON A BOTTLE AND IN DIAPERS!!!!!!! Made us just shudder. And I saw this kid just a few years ago at a wedding my mom was photographing...he walked behind his sister everywhere she went with his head down and just seemed not right. And I think his upbringing had a lot to do with it. Now THAT'S just not right..........

Annette said...

This summer we were at a festival. We were walking back to our car and there was a kid crying in the parking lot and his mom was getting stuff out of the trunk. He had to be at LEAST 8 years old! He was standing behind the car in a diaper...no clothes...no shoes...bottle in his hand...hanging his head in shame. The kid seemed totally functional and in no way needed to be treated like the baby his mom was making him. I mean seriously...even if the child had a problem and needed to be wearing a diaper...PUT SOME CLOTHES ON HIM!!! There were hundreds of people around. It was one of the most disturbing things I have ever seen...and let me tell you...I have seen A LOT!!!!

Elizabeth F. said...

I'm not doubting any of your stories, but just be aware that some kids are just BIG! I have some friends who have a son adn EVERYONE thinks their kid is 5 or 6 when he was 3. So, tall kids get a bad rap. People expect them to act older even if they are not developmentally ready. Just throwing that in there for thought.

Elizabeth F. said...

You guys have dirty minds--I never even thought of that! Yuck!

Elizabeth F. said...

LLL advocates "Weaning With Love." Which means at whatever babies' age if mommy wants to wean before baby that it be done lovingly, gently, and gradually. Don't just wean cold turkey, let them scream and be confused, or be harsh.

Elizabeth F. said...

only 30 more comments people! We are almost there!

Sarafu said...

First of all, I would like to say YAHOO for mrs Sara! I am So proud that you knew that the WHO recomended that babies nurse for a minimum of 2 years. That post made me smile. :)
I htought I would throw in my own weaning experience since we are on the topic. I tried to begin weaning several times when Jack was about 18 months to 2 years old but every time he was absolutley NOT ready for it. Some babies are ready at 12 months and some are ready at 2. I chose to listen to Jacks cues and held off because it is what I felt was best. Now, when I was pregnant, I decided it was time to be done. But this time Jack dealt with it much better. It was amazing the difference. He was ready but he still needed a little help with it. E, I loved the "weanign with love" expression.

Sarafu said...

Hey Patty, I just have to say that I am so glad that I never had the experience of being bitten by a child with a mouth full of teeth! OUCH!!!!!

birdietwoshoes said...

Seriously... we're gonna make it to 100 comments. I could just post "Boobies on a Plane" 27 more times so I could be the winner. (Everytime I think of that now, it makes me laugh)

And Daniel, "BFing" is starting to sound, I don't know... dirty or something to me too. :) Even though it's way stinkin' shorter to type. :)

jenny said...

boobies on a plane:)

jenny said...

boobies on a plane:)

jenny said...

boobies on a plane:)

jenny said...

lol now we're 3 closer to 100 and i got to keep saying "boobies"

Elizabeth F. said...

This blog is turning into a Breastfeeding Education class! So wonderful!

Another great reason to BFeed...
I went to the Memorial Auditorium to see Sara's dad sing today and Zachary was extremely squirmy. Well, guess what kept him still and QUIET for at least a few minutes? You guessed it...
A Boob!

Elizabeth F. said...

Oh...and when you have a newborn you can take baby to the movies with you. It's dark in there, you just hold baby and nurse through the movie. It worked great for us at least until he got too active. I was just never ready to leave baby that early and it was great cause I could still get out.

Elizabeth F. said...

#80

Boobies on a Plane!

OK...I'm done.

patty said...

URGENT HELP NEEDED ON PAT PARKER'S BLOG. GO TO www.pattythoughts.blogspot.com. I am going CRAZY with nap time. I need some advice. Hey, you can post it here and copy it to my blog too and that way we can get to 100. Okay, instead of Bfing, let's say bfeeding. only leaves out 5 letters, but then we can all get past what we really know it stands for: BOOGER FLIPPING. Hahahahha. okay, I'm done.

patty said...

...BOOGER FLIPPING.....

patty said...

...BOOGER FLIPPING....

patty said...

...boogers on a plane.............

Sarafu said...

You would think with as much as we have Typed the word "boobies" that the authors were a bunch of guys, and Now we have added Boogers! We are some classy gals! :) LOL!

Sarafu said...

Hey Sara, I fixed your link.

Elizabeth F. said...

Pat,
Remind us of how old she is now. age really makes a difference...

I have found that laying with my kids sometimes distracts them. They think it's PLAYTIME! So, they have to go it alone.

I'm not an advocate of cryin git out, but there are a few times that I have tried everything. I know they are just deliriously tired. I have had to put them in their bed and let them cry. For me, 15 mins is about the max. I do not believe in letting kids cry for longer. Usually 5-10 mins does it and they are zonked out.

I think you are are the right track and doing the right things. Preparation is key. You're doing that. Transition time...reading...you're doing that.

The only 2 things I suggest are:
1-You cannot make a child go to sleep. (Unless you drug them! he...he...) We go through phases where nap is not going well. So, I tell them to not go to sleep. (Reverse Psychology soemtimes works) They HAVE TO HAVE QUIET TIME though. Reading books on their bed. Maybe a movie if all else fails. There are consequences for getting out of their bed though. It sucks, I know. Our quiet time is at least 1-1.5 hours. Usually they fall asleep and it ends up being longer.

2-Sometimes when children get over-tired they fight it more. Try putting her down sooner. I saw a Pediatrician on TV one time that said that. I thought he was nuts. HE said, "Sleep begets sleep." The more you get, the more you want. So, I started putting my kids down sooner at night and bedtime did get easier.I have found that it works for naps as well.

Good Luck!!

Anonymous said...

#88!

Thanks, Fu. I pride myself on being informed on women's health issues. :) Hopefully sometime soon I'll get to use all my info... c'mon Dan, get me pregnant! :) (Said the month-old newlywed.)

Oh, I just realized that I got married a month ago! That's nuts!

Anonymous said...

Wow, we're up to 88 and everyone's gonna poop out? C'mon, ladies! We're talking about boobies here! LMAO.

#89, by the way.

Annette said...

Sara's right I mean you could talk about boobies forever.

Annette said...

You can talk about boobies in the morning....

Annette said...

boobies in the afternoon....

Annette said...

boobies in the evening....

Annette said...

underneath the moonlight

Annette said...

I've got boobies...you've got boobies....everybody have a boobies party!

Annette said...

You know...I guess I never realized how diffrent peoples parenting skills/ideas are.

Annette said...

Doesn't anyone else have something to say?

Annette said...

I'm gonna get it to 100 comments!

Annette said...

Look at me go! Where is everyone!

Annette said...

ugh oh....this is 99...last chance ladies!!!

Annette said...

BELLS and WHISTLES!!!! Balloons are falling! I'm doing the happy dance in my cubicle. Oh my gosh...I'd like to thank the academy. My friends and family that always believed in me. Without you I couldn't have said the word boobies so many times.

Anonymous said...

Oh man, just missed it! #102! DOH!

Way to go, Netta! You deserve it!

Anonymous said...

LET'S GO TO 200! :)

Sarafu said...

Holy Cow, I am gone for the afternoon and it passes 100!!! I am going to have to think of something unique for the prize. Hey, it gives a whole new meaning to "booby prize" doesnt it? LOL!!

Sarafu said...

I bet if we switched topics from boobs to parenting styles that we could sure as hell make it to 200!

Sarafu said...

I have my computer back up and running so I guess I could post something.

Sarafu said...

Hey Pat, Diddo on waht E said about the whole nap thing. Shes so smart! :) I love naps! Jack and Asher are taking taking one right now! Hence why I am able to post. :) Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh!
Another great thing about nursing........ Asher nursed for 5 minutes and hes out! No screaming involved!

Elizabeth F. said...

Holy crap! You cheaters...with the multiple comments. I was so going to win that!

And, Annette yes almost every parent on the planet has a different idea of how things should be done when it comes to parenting. The beauty of it all is that different things work for different kids/families. So you can hear all of the advice, then pick and choose what works best for you. It makes sense if we remember that children are individuals with personalities. A one-size-fits-all approach does not work for all kids. I have 3 kids, and have found that what works for one does not work for them all. Keeps us on our toes.And it sucks. Why can't parenting be easier?

Anonymous said...

If parenting were easy, every idiot would want to do it. And that's definitely not a good idea.

Sarafu said...

Good Point Mrs Sara. I wish I could go back in time and show these comments of mine to the Pre Baby Sara. I would have crapped my pants at the things I was saying. I probablly would have argued with myself. :) Hahaha! I think the whole realization that kids are different and may have different parenting/discipline styles was huge for me. The other transition I made when I had kids was the fact that these kids were people with feelings and needs. I think I always had a subconcious thought that they were babies and needed me to show them how things were going to be. I once had a girl tell me that her children came into her house and life so they were going to have to learn her schedule and do things her way. I thought, "what an awful statment" and then I thought, wait, I used to think like that.
What are some things that you guys thought you would do when you had kids that you have abandoned. Or for those of you who dont have kids you can just maybe say what you think your parenting philosophy might be.

Anonymous said...

I definitely disagree with the "my house, my schedule" thing! How ridiculous! They're little babies, and they have needs that parents have to fulfill. How selfish to say that they need to fit into your schedule! What if your baby is hungry at three in the morning, but your schedule says you need to sleep! What are you gonna do then? Let her starve? Geez.

I'm not quite sure how my entire parenting style is going to be when I have children, but I do know a few specific things that I definitely want to include into my children's lives. For instance, I'd like my children to believe that their opinions are important. Within reason, of course, but I'd like for them to help choose the clothing they're going to wear for the day, and when they get older, they can start making more important decisions. When I was growing up, I didn't feel my opinion was important at all, and I don't want my kids to feel that way. I'd like them to feel in control of their own lives... once again, within reason. Dan and I are still the parents, and sometimes we'll need to help them make the right choices.

Anonymous said...

I also know that I'm definitely going to be watching closely for their God-given talents, and I'm going to help and encourage them to pursue them.

Anonymous said...

And bedtime is at 4:30 PM. :)

Anonymous said...

AND NO SCARY MOVIES UNTIL THEY'RE OLD ENOUGH TO VOTE! YOU HEAR ME, DAN CARTER???

My husband started watching scary movies (milder ones, I guess) with his dad when he was like 5 years old. That's WAY too early for my liking. I hate scary movies and think they're disgusting and horrible, but Dan loves them, so I'm sure we'll have to come to some agreement about that. Sigh. I think that since I'm the momma, my decision should be final! :)

Annette said...

I agree with what Sara C said about her parenting style. I do however in some ways agree with the girl that said "my house, my schedule" Now I don't mean I wouldn't feed a hungry baby at 3am. However...I have several friends here who have healthy, loving, intelligent, adorable, fun to be around kids who don't let their kids "run their lives" They are still as active as they used to be. They don't go home because their child is tired. They have submerged their children into their lives. The kids aren't phased at all by the parenting style. If they are tired, they just lay down and go to sleep. If they are hungry, their mom has yogurt and raisins and snacks for them. All of that is within reason of course, but the child is going to be a part of "our family" and needs to be that...a part of our family. I know I don't have kids yet, but I have seen families go both ways. Some you never see again...their kids are a pain in the a** to be around because they are whiney little brats that always get their way...and then there are people like the Murphy's who have a healthy balance and always seem to be open to hanging out..taking their kids bowling with the gang...road trips...camping in the winter...etc. and the kids are great, happy, pleasant to be around, everyone loves them. Someone told me once that you have to ask yourself a question..."is your child a blessing or a curse to be around" I want my kids to be a blessing. Finding the balance in that...I'm not sure how, but that's what I want.

Anonymous said...

That sounds great, Netta! I don't think your children should run your life by any means. I just meant that there are some women who are quite selfish and would sacrifice their children's wellbeing for their own personal convenience, and that's ridiculous.

birdietwoshoes said...

Seriously, Sarafu, I think 10 comments it the most I've ever gotten... Sheesh!

So parenting styles, eh? Here's how I feel about it-- Kids are a huge responsibilty and absolutely life changing. However, I don't feel that you need to change your life all around for them. This does not mean that you won't have to make sacrifices. This does not mean that you'll be able to carry on just like you did before. I just mean that your "life" doesn't have to end just because you have children. For example, I am working on getting Rachel (my 5 week old) into a feed/wake/sleep routine. So far, it's working very well for both of us. I feed her about every 3 hours (of course, give or take a little--if she wakes up after 2 1/2 hours and is hungry, I feed her) Then we have play time, then she takes a nap. At night, she sleeps VERY well. She actually goes 4-5 hours at night. Last night she went down a little after 10 and didn't wake up until 3:30! Because she's somewhat predictable, I can adjust my schedule to do things around her predictability. I don't have to worry about going out and her being hungry at random times or anything. The day after Thanksgiving, my husband watched her while I went shopping for 8 hours (I pumped in the car-- That was interesting!) And she was fine with Daddy! I was so happy!

So... that's what's going on here. It's definitely not "Mommys house, mommys schedule" But it's not, "Here I am mommy and daddy! I'm going to put a halt to your life!" either. It's like any relationship, really. Give and take. 50/50. It's interesting to me, being a new mother, how much a child changes your life and that sacrificing things like full night's sleep and hot meals are so worth the joy of being a mother.

Ok, that was long enough.. I'll stop for now! :)

Sarafu said...

Netta, I completly understand what you are saying! In my own experiance the people that say that they want their children "scheduled" to their lives are the people that have nap times at noon bedtime at 5 and NO wavering of any sort. Now, my children (as of yet anyway) are extremly flexible because I am not a Super scheduled person. If I am at someones elses house at naptime then they just take one there. Now, some of this has to do with the personality of my kids becasue I know some kids Just dont function well under that. My kids have their own schedule but its not rigid because for me personally that would drive me insane. We have to figure out what works for us and keeps us moms sane! :)
I think the bottom line is to LISTEN to your child and KNOW that they are not puppies that we train but have feelings behind their cries. After all that is the ONLY way they can communicate, as newborns anyway. Like you said Sara, Its important to know that your opinions count, even when your 3. Obviously we are parents and we have the final say and its imperitive to have boundries. Attatchment parenting doesnt mean that we arent strict and that we let our kids run our lives. Hopefully it doesnt come across that way. :)

patty said...

okay, going for 200. Sara Fu "booby prize" hee hee. THAT's funny. What did I say I'd do and I've abandoned. Let's see, Day and I had a conversation that went something like this (when I was early PG or just before we got PG)

Pat: "so you're telling me that when you come home from work, any night of the week I can just leave the baby with you and go out and have a life?"

Day: Absolutely.

today: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA UHHHH.....yah...........

Sarafu said...

Its funny, I grew up in an area where everyone parented and taught from that Crazy man, Gary Ezzos books. you know the "Baby Wise" and "Growing Kids Gods Way", growing kids gods way, my a##! :) Anyway, Thats where I got my basic idea of parenting. I think its important that we at least know that there are other parenting options out there and that they arent just ones that kids walk all over you. Thank God for Dr Sears! :)

patty said...

Okay, I "published" before I should have. I also need to include that it is more me than him that this DOESN'T happen when it can. When he's working over, obviously this won't work.When I finally DO get out, I'm gone an hour and miss her to death. hahaha. SO I get my stuff done and come home. But even last night, I went to the store for just a few things while he had her in the bath. On the way home I just felt SO much better. And I realized I'd only been gone a half hour. I guess with our situation, losing a few babies early on and then Annalynn not coming along til we'd been married 14 years, maybe that puts a different spin on things. I had someone say to me recently that she'd hate to see me go thru this whole pregnancy/newborn stage again at my age because I'd be missing out on a new career and some of the exciting things to go do in life. Well, here's what I say to that: Day and I have moved 14 times in 16 1/2 years. We have "done" lots of cool stuff, the prayer walk in Atlanta, the inner city ministry stuff, we've lived in Valpo, Gary, Michigan City, Wanatah, Atlanta and numerous other places. We've done the biker thing although I hope to return to that and miss it IMMENSELY. but I've done the "career"thing. I've worked all kinds of jobs and had my fun. SO NOW I'M READY TO STAY HOME AND JUST BE A MOM. I brought that to her attention and she said "oh, well, I guess you're right." WE just did things a little backwards. And as for the parenting thing, I'm still figuring it out. I want Annalynn to be a part of things we do, but I also know for us things are easier when we stick to a schedule and she doesn't do well with sleeping in other places and most of that is my undoing from not being willing to let go of her for the first year. But as she grows, we'll do more and stay more places. okay. are we really going for 200??? Will we make BLOGGER HISTORY???

patty said...

regarding the "fun" comment in my previous post...........I have had "my fun" but now I'm having a new kind of fun.......you moms know what I'm talking about........the fun you have when you're cleaning marker off that little face, cleaning the banana out of the pocket in the arm of the chair she was keeping 'til later, finding the popsicle stick and wondering where the puddle is, and oh so much more. Life is definitely different, but I'd never go back.

Sarafu said...

Pat, I totally understand that some children need to be abit more scheduled. Like I said, It depends on your child as well as the parent. Its what works for each person. Most people think that we are INSANE when they call our house at 9 and our kids are still up but it works for us. Our children are not scarred and neither are we so why do people care? Plus, they sleep in in the morning so I enjoy that. Obviously when Jack starts school some day things will have ot change but this optimizes our time as a family. ANyway, I am rambling!
By the way Pat......Annalyn is ADORABLE!!! Cute doesnt even cover it. Everytime I see her on my fridge, I just melt! :)

Sarafu said...

Birdie, I dont know how I missed your comment but I just now saw it. I am by no means saying that our world shoudl revolve around our kids! My house would be insane. :) LOL! Oh wait, sometimes it is anyway :). I personaly, am one for feesing on demand and not really scheduling my babies feeding time because I figure they can communicate to me their needs when they need it but that works well for me. As you can probally tell, I am not a fan of the "let them cry it out method" or the whole Baby Wise theory but I think that some babies are MUCH easier to schedule. Some it doesnt even phase and so there is no crying involved. Again, back to the whole thing of Knowing and listening to your child.
Just so everyone knows, I am all for kids having schedules. I do beleive they need them in order, well, to keep everyone happy. If Jack doesnt have a nap by 4 or 5 then we are in for a Treat! :)

Sarafu said...

Hey, can someone tell me why Doctors care so much about how we parent? I mean, Obviously they want to make sure that our children are being well taken care of. But, Why is it that my pediatrician cares if my son is still nursing at night at 1 year? Is it keeping him awake? Heck, sometimes, I dont even wake up! :)
Sidenote...I really do love my pediatrician

Elizabeth F. said...

I think I get what Annette is trying to say, however, while I think it may work for some families to take their kids wherever they go on their own schedule...I think this is a best case scenario thing. Some of us may think that's what we will do, but when we actually have the kids it really is much harder to do than anticipated. Going places takes on a whole new meaning, especially during certain stages. And some babies won't sleep in other places after they surpass the newborn sleep in the carseat stage. Some kids get so hysterically tired that going home is the only option. For me, I feel that I would be selfish to expect my kids to go along and ENJOY the things that I want to do ALL OF THE TIME. Sure, there's are times that they need to do that, but there needs to be a balance. My children's needs always come first though.

I did not wait as long as Pat to have a baby or have near the disappointment in trying, but when I had Zoe I was ready. She was ALL that I cared about. Life stopped, and I cherished every moment that I had with her. I am happy being a mom. Sure, there are times I need to get out, but I find myself being like Pat and after a short time out I need to rush home to make sure everyone is ok. And they always are, but there's a place in my heart that NEEDS to be with my children. It's hard to explain. Zachary is 15 mos. old and I have never been away from him longer than 3-4hours. Zoe and Xander have only had a few overnights with family, maybe 5 in almost 6 years.

Alot of people think about "kids" in an inanimate way. Like they are things or possessions. I like Sara's comparison of a puppy to train. With each child that enters our family I get a deeper understanding of what it truly means to be a family. Sharing the same space, taking into account every person's unique needs and personalities, learing to work together to make the household run smoothly. Most importantly, I believe God has given each one of these children to me for a reason. With each child, my rough edges continue to be smoothed. They teach me just as much as I teach them. I am evolving and still learning. I thought I knew everything when I started this journey and now I am so much more humble and recognize that I do not have all of the answers. I will never have all of them. God chose us to be their mothers for a reason and I believe he gave them to us for a reason too. (So that we can stop being selfish, to learn to serve wholeheartedly, among many others reasons.) God gives us babies as a blessing, and in my opinion kids are never a curse...even when they are at their worst!

Some kids just go through difficult stages no matter what style of parenting is used. Sure, it's ok to take a break from being around them if it is too difficult for you, but those seasons pass and it would be sad to lose a good friendship over something like that.

IMO, if you are not willing to have your life change b/c of children, then you probably should wait. No matter how hard you try and fight it, YOUR LIFE WILL CHANGE! (Like it or not.) :-)

patty said...

hey, I just thought of one of my parenting opinions. Most of you can tell by looking at me that food has been a problem in my life. I could tell you all the awful hurtful stories, but then this would be about me and not my daughter.....In my life experiences and in weight watchers and even the WIC information and Hoosier Healthwise info I got when pregnant with and when Annalynn was a newborn (Day had lost his job and we were getting help for awhile...) and also throw in some advice from Dr.McGuckin, I usually also let Annalynn "tell" me when she's hungry. we don't eat at 8am just because it's 8am and time for breakfast. We don't eat at noon because "it's time for lunch." and so on and so forth. She will go for a day or so and not eat much. Then she'll have a day or two when she eats a lot. I always "offer" meals around"mealtimes" so again don't call social services. haha. It's just that I offer and if she is truly not hungry, she tells me and I don't force it. Now if I think she might be hungry because I picked up on some signals, and I know she just really wants to go play with something that caught her eye, I'll ask her to eat just a little of whatever..and if she does and she is hungry, she does the 'oh yeah, I guess I am hungry' and sits and eats. (she doesn't say it, she does it...). Or sometimes she'll say something about her tummy. Then I know she's truly hungry. See, I believe that we need to eat when we're hungry, that's why God gave us hunger signs. Our bodies know what they need. Sometimes, as in my case, our hearts and minds don't know what's best for us. I do NOT want her to have a weight problem like I have. we will never use food as a reward or punishment. She will never HAVE to clean her plate to eat dessert........(big no-no in my book...) and sometimes I let her eat a few bites of her dessert first if she wants.....not that we always have dessert. And yes, sometimes she even gets a cookie for breakfast or lunch. I have an acquaintance that literally will PUT FOOD in her child's mouth and YELL at the child to "EAT IT YOU NEED PROTEIN TONIGHT." one time we were over and this was going on and the child was gagging. I almost ruined a friendship over that one....very hard to keep your mouth shut when someone else thinks they know best....and no, this child is not thin ...in my opinion there is a weight problem just brewing here... Even a ped at her regular doc's office told me "starvation doesn't send kids to the hospital, dehydration does...." (I am not talking about third world countries or poverty stories) I am talking if your kid is not HUNGRY don't make them EAT. Just my opinion.

Anonymous said...

Pat, I totally agree with you on the eating thing. We definitely need to learn to eat because of our hunger cues, not because it's lunch time. I think that will probably help Annalynn to not be overweight. I wish I would have had parents who wouldn't have pushed me to eat all the time. Not trying to blame my obesity on them, I'm just saying.

Anonymous said...

But hell, if we can blame obesity on our parents, maybe I should! LMAO. Mommy didn't breastfeed me for very long! That's why I'm fat! LOL. Just joking, Mom. (if you're reading this)

Sarafu said...

LMAO!!!!!!

Annette said...

Elizabeth, just for clarification...I am in no way saying my life won't change when I have kids or that I'm not flexible. I also never said I wasn't friends with someone anymore because of their kids. What I was trying to say was that some people just disappear when they have kids. They never leave their house, they don't want people over, they don't call, they just disappear. When I said the "blessing or a curse" thing...it is what I believe a parent has to ask themselves at certain moments. If your child is throwing a fit in the middle of the grocery store and you have tried for several minutes to console them and calm the situation and it is escalading...I think you should ask yourself that question...it may mean you leave your cart in the store and head home. If you know your child hasn't had a nap and they are out of control without one and won't nap on the run, don't take them out. I know that children are precious and blessings and gifts from God...I hope you all heard that in what I said. I don't want anyone to think I'm a callosed selfish woman who wants to have kids.

birdietwoshoes said...

So now would be a bad time to mention that I read BabyWise? :) I agreed with some of it, but not all of it. Like the whole, "when it's time for a nap, put your baby down and let her cry herself to sleep" thing. No, sorry, can't do it. There are times when we have let her cry things out. Like the time she was fed, changed, burped and everything else and she was not in the least bit happy wih anything we did. We just had to put her down and let her cry. And that was hard, but we felt it was the right thing to do. But I agree with you, Sara, it's all about knowing and listening to your child. This seems to be working for Rachel, but who knows for the next one.

It's funny--I'm not a fan of attachment parenting theories and you're not a fan of Baby Wise theories, yet we can still voice and respect each other's opinions. I mean, I hope you don't think I'm doing this all wrong and am starting out being a bad mother. Just from talking with Sara and reading her blog and Elizabeth's blog, I can tell how much they absolutely love their kids and love being a mother, so I hope they don't think I think they're bad mothers because they go with the AP style of parenting. It's just not for me.

Anyway, Sara, you should post something new so we can start commenting on the new post--It takes WAY to long to scroll to the bottom to read the latest comments. (LOL!)

Anonymous said...

Netta, (and everyone else) I certainly didn't take your comments to mean that you're selfish! It's sometimes hard to have conversations like this on a blog, because you can't look at the people you're talking to and read their facial expressions. So sometimes comments get misunderstood, or someone replies to your comment and you think they thought you meant something different than what you really meant. It's hard!

I do like being able to talk on blogs, though, because I normally wouldn't have a chance to talk to most of these folks! :)

Anonymous said...

By the way, who wants to see my wedding pictures? They're up today! :)

http://www.amelsephoto.com/Dan%20&%20Sara.htm

On this page, click the yellow button and search for Westforth to see the rest of the photos! YAY PHOTOS!

Can you tell I'm a little overly excited?

Sarafu said...

No Worries Birdie! I dont think your a bad mom in the slightest. I just know that the AP style parenting works with mine and my husbands personalities and I feel like it is what comes naturally. Gary Ezzos stuff is kinda like fitting a square peg in a round whole to me.
I think the major thing is listening to your child and to your own instincts. As long as you do that and dont blindy listen to someones advice without being educated.
You love Rachel and your a fabulous parent I'm sure! She is a beautiful baby too! :)

Elizabeth F. said...

The fact that we are all on here tlaking about our kids or future kids proves that we have their best interest at heart. None of us are selfish!! I agree that it is great that even with differing viewpoints we can come to one place and share and learn from each other. It takes a VILLAGE to raise a child!

Elizabeth F. said...

Annette,
Most of my comment was not directed towards you, sorry that it sounded that way.

I persoanlly have had several situations where I had a friend and their kids were either really annoying to be around or a bad influence on my kids or hurt my kids and I had to make the painful decision of what to do...

About the blessing vs. curse thing...maybe curse is a strong word. I would never feel that about my kids no matter how bad they were. I do know what you are saying though and there have been many times that I leave, not for the sake of others, but because my children need to learn the lesson that it is unacceptable to behave that way. So, the natural consequence is to leave. I really don't care too much what others think of my kids. People will always make judgements on your kids and on your parenting style despite any amount of effort that you put into it.

Elizabeth F. said...

Pat,
I totally agree! We do have structured meal times, but our kids NEVER have to finish their plates and we do not use dessert as a tool to get kids to eat more. Double whammy there!! We just try to offer a variety of healthy choices, and if the kids want down from the table before they eat enough, I say, "Eat 4 more green beans, etc..." and then you are excused. That way I get a little more into them and there's no fight. Then, they are excused. Growing up, I had to sit at the table for hours until I cleaned my plate. I hated it.

Sarafu said...

Can I just apologize to all the parents and children out there that I have judged after seeing their kids throw fits in public places! As a parent, now I realize that it is at times inevitable. If I need groceries and my kids are having a rough day but I HAVE to take them out because we have no food or whatever the case may be a fit is a possibility but the alternative to the fit is worse because it is givong in to whatever the child may want. If Jack wants candy and I say "no" then he may throw a fit but the other option is giving the candy to make him stop which is teaching him that if he throws a big enough fit then he will eventually get what he wants. I think sometimes you can leave but other times its not on option. Unless of course you have a babysitter at your disposal that you can call during the day when you need to run errands. Wouldnt that be nice!

Anonymous said...

I hope when I have babies my mom will want the kids to come over when I'm grocery shopping... because from what I can tell, it's HELL to shop with a child!

Sarafu said...

Yah, I used to take Jack to my moms. She loved ANY excuse to watch him. It was SUPER nice!
Man, I miss her!!
A little encouragment Sara, its not always ba

Sarafu said...

Sorry, Asher hit send while I was typing. As I was saying, its not always bad shopping with kids. I have have had more pleasent experiances than bad. Its normally bad when they are long trips or at the wrong time. It is fun to be able to get them a little treat and see their face light up. Its really funny when you tell them they can pick out a treat and they pick out cherry tomatoes or bannanas. :)

Anonymous said...

Aw, that's cute!

Elizabeth F. said...

For me, if it is not a run in and run out of the store thing...it is HELL! Don't do it! LOL!

patty said...

funny we're on the subject of grocery shopping now,just today, I took Annalynn with me to Town andCountry. We went in and all was well. She wanted to push her own little cart. Oh, how sweet. No problem. Well, those damn little carts would not work right. ANY OF THE 4 WE TRIED...the wheels on the front would not straighten out and go...she tried one, I tried 3 more. Okay honey, they won't work today, just come and sit in mommy's cart.....wwwahaaaaaaaa.....I pick her up, you all know what I mean when you try to pick up a 2 1\2 year old and those feet will NOT go in the holes.....I was having a "helpmelordjesusbeforeilosemymind" moment.I could see out of the corner of my eye this woman standing there watching me.....I thought "just say something..." and she leaned over and said "honey I feel for you. I SO know what you are feeling like right now. I left all 4 at HOME today" and we had a good laugh. And you know what, just the fact that another mom lent me a bit of sympathy was so encouraging to me and it helped me to feel better immediately. We got ourselves under control and had a nice shopping trip......well, mostly.....

Sarafu said...

Oh Pat, I have SO been there! But you are SO right. Its such a releif when some other woman comes over and sympathizes with you and tells you "its OK, we have all been there". It helps you feel less guilty about the fact that the entire store can hear your child screaming. :)